James Tyrrell feels the effect of a decline in the goat population
Jason, ha naghlaq dal-kamp ma jmurx ikun hawn xi moghoz ghaddej bil-lejl.
Here’s an exchange from timesofmalta.com, in which James Tyrrell, an interfering Irishman who campaigned for Malta to vote No in the EU membership referendum, calls Malta a dictatorship and demands a referendum on the Piano project.
James A. Tyrrell
Dr. Gatt accuses Joseph Muscat of actually having the audacity to listen to what the electorate are saying and act upon it with regard to his decision-making. Something you certainly can’t accuse Gonzi PN of doing.
Also he almost accuses Joseph Muscat of creating the fact that the majority of people are against this project when it was this very paper which held a poll the results of which was an overwhelming majority of over 80% against.
In conclusion I object to his use of the word democracy in his article, as this is obviously an alien concept in Malta. Like it or not you are living in a dictatorship where you have no say whatsoever in how your country is run or how your money is spent.
CVella
It’s a strange sort of democracy that enables an Irishman to tell us that we live in a dictatorship, that the government isn’t doing its job when it takes action and that the Opposition is taking action when it doesn’t do its job.
With delicious irony, you support your argument by quoting an opinion poll run online by an independent newspaper, using that newspaper’s electronic medium to do so. It seems it’s some Irish (or Black and Tan?), not the Maltese, who need lessons in democracy.
James Tyrrell
First of all I’m not Irish I’m British. Obviously you don’t know the difference between Northern Ireland and Southern Ireland. Hardly a surprise I suppose.
Secondly a dictatorship is a government controlled by one person or a small group of people without the consent of those being governed. Given the fact that the majority of Maltese people according to the papers are against the Piano project as it stands and your Government are totally ignoring what they say, then yes you are living in a dictatorship.
I assume you just threw in the phrase ‘Black and Tan’ as it was something you remember reading in a comic, probably quite recently.
C Vella
I take it you believe what the papers say, so take a look at these headlines which report on the outcome of a democratic electoral process www.timesofmalta.com/election2008
Dictators tend not to allow oppositional voices to be heard so if this were a dictatorship, you’d be unable to compete with Igalea on timesofmalta.com for the grouch of the month award.
The difference between Northern Ireland and Southern Ireland is clear, hence the expression Black and Tan.
James Tyrrell
We’ll forget the Irish comments, as you obviously have no idea what you are talking about. I could of course educate you but it would obviously be a waste of time.
Regarding the dictatorship versus democracy issue there is a very easy way to settle that one. All the Government have to do is call a Referendum. Why are they afraid to do this?
It is after all the democratic way of doing things. If the Government are so convinced that they are right then put it to the people and let them decide. If they continue to refuse to do this then the clear message they are sending out is that the people’s opinion doesn’t matter and they will decide on behalf of the people into which greasy palms the 100 million Euros is put.
By the way you should have noticed by now that it is not only non voters like myself who are calling for this, and not just Labour Party voters trying to stir things up for the present administration but die hard PN supporters as well.
C Vella
It’s interesting that you think the deciding factor on a public project is who will get the money, and that all the palms involved are necessarily greasy. A referundum is a democratic tool, but it is not the definitive measure of a country’s democracy.
Your experience of referendums in Malta is limited, I’d imagine, to the most recent one in which the results were disputed. That particular mechanism, and the way its results were interpreted, would not resolve the problem you see in this case.
I do have to ask, though, why you are so exercised by such matters. Is it a particular hobby or yours or is there no distraction in your part of the world?
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oh Mr Tyrell, if only you were here in the Labour days – you would have been bundled on an outbound flight before you could say ‘ you live in a democracy, NOT’
My my how this Tyrrell fellow changes his tone of voice and language according to the website he’s posting comments on. Mr. adapting chameleon personified.
So, Tyrrell, in view of the diminishing polulation of goats, do an adapting job and go f**k a duck.
Coming from a person who used brute force to suppress his fellow countrymen is the pits.
Yes, probably a lack of goats, sheep, chicken and other farm animals. Not sure how they do it in Ireland or wherever he decides he is from, but a government which is elected via a democratic election has been given a mandate to govern and take decisions, and there is no obligation to consult anyone about these.
Just the fact that the government actually consults the opposition, unions, and the rest is proof of democracy, but consulting does not mean accepting what the other parties want. The final decision is in the government’s hands, and no referendum is needed. The “referendum” will be held at the next election.
@Tyrell
There is just ONE Ireland.
If you consider yourself as British then you must be a descendent of the Presbyterian SCOTTISH settlers brought over in order to help implement what today is call ethnic cleansing, similar to what happened in Serbia.
No Tyrell, C. Vella has read the history books, the Black and Tans were the British criminals set loose in Ireland by the British Govt, to murder and rape in the 1920s.
This man needs to understand that there is not one type of democratic process. There is direct democracy (by referendum, e.g.) and there is representative democracy (through parliament). There is also dictatorial democracy (Hitler was so democratic he had a motto which ran: one people, one “empire”, one leader). There is also proletarian democracy (which we saw in the Communist regimes).
“Democracy” is a term which has been widely abused.
Malta is run by means of a parliamentary or representative democracy. Direct democracy was rarely practised here, and – given the few instances when it was – one would conclude that the time is still not ripe for it.
Also, referendums can be so very tricky. The question may be put in such a way as to trick the electorate.
One may look at California, US, to see the negative effects of too much direct democracy.
Or to the Swiss mess created by allowing the “people” (not their representatives) to decide on mosque-building. Many Maltese workers and businessmen whose livelihood depends on the Libyan market were adversely hit by Swiss direct democracy.
Experience shows that the best (though far from perfect) method of government is parliamentary, or representative, democracy.
James A. Tyrrell understands the implications of a referendum. He vociferously campaigned for a ‘No’ vote – even though he is not entitled to vote here.
“First of all I’m not Irish I’m British.”
I can’t imagine how many times James got the shit kicked out of him for that statement in Ireland.
He’s such a giant http://img.en.china.cn/0/0,0,152,16458,689,531,9ae236fd.jpg
Some 30 years ago Mr. Tyrrell would have been exiled from Malta for interfering in our internal affairs.
@C Vella
Well, we did learn earlier on about the decline in goat population. Could there be a link?
Southern Ireland? Only a Brit could describe it that way. Southern Ireland doesn’t exist. I should know because I live in the Republic of Ireland.
@James Tyrell. Here are some fine examples of UK democracy. The war in Iraq. Hugely unpopular, and the majority were against. The British Government ignored the people and went to war. The reasoning was based on a huge lie – WMD. Afganistan – the majority of the British people were against but… as above. The poll tax, hugely unpopular and unfair and the cause of riots in the streets of London. The poll tax is still hated and still in force, with a different name. Decisions taken by the British government which where not put to the people include hundreds of billions of taxpayers’ money used to shore up failed banks. The result of which is that Britain’s economy is in a complete mess and it is expected that the effects will be felt for at least ten years. Think about these. Do you still think Malta is a dictatorship? FYI I am Maltese (and proud of it) and live in London. Have a good day.
This is another gem by the same Tyrrell, again commenting on timesofmalta.com regarding the ‘Hate Gonzi’ Facebook group. (They haven’t yet invented commas in County Antrim.)
“It’s every bit as likely and in fact it could be argued more likely that this site is being run my PN supporters in order to try and discredit members of the Labour Party and raise sympathy for poor Dr. Gonzi. Sometimes you have to stare very hard at the trees before you see the wood!”
http://www.timesofmalta.com/articles/view/20100203/local/labour-mp-denies-link-with-facebook-hate-gonzi-group
This Tyrell has a problem coming, as he himself admits, from a non country (Northern Ireland). He is obviously an Orangeman. The least said the better. No wonder he eloped to Gozo. If he believes that democratic countries hold national referendums to decide on developing a plot of land in ruins he is certainly cuckoo.
I challenge him to quote one example from one European democratic country (except CH where they hold referendums on the siting of dog loos) where a national referendum was ever held to decide on the reconstruction of a bombed site.
The goats migrated to a safer place when James Tyrrell retired to Gozo.
Now Denis Catania is going to be jealous that someone else is stealing the limelight.
Make that “Denis Catania and Astrid Vella are going to be jealous…”
Some people have no idea why and when a referendum should be held. We elect a government once every five years to fulfill its mandate which it gets from us the electorate after we have seen what they are proposing in their electoral manifestos.
Obviously very few actually read these manifestos. To my knowledge the PN had this project in its manifesto and it is fulfilling its mandate. We do not need a referendum. I remember that when Richard England worked on the completion of St. James Cavalier there were many dissenting voices. I think very few would be of the same opinion today.
Obviously nothing is perfect and many might think they could do better. I for one would not be so arrogant – bil-Malti zattat – to think I know better than a world-renowned architect like Piano.
This is of course the same Tyrrell of the Royal Ulster Constabulary who would have gladly brandished his own version of referendum on the Catholics of Northern Ireland, on a daily basis if necessary. Don’t you just recognise a coconut when it stares you in the face.
I started reading this article with the solemn intent to poke holes in anything James Tyrrell had to say. He’s no stranger to the meaningless aside or the extravagant non sequitur, and I wasn’t expecting him to change tack.
But he does have a point. Why not call a referendum? It is of course EXTREMELY likely that the opposition would use the conflict to siphon off political brownie points, but that consideration will ALWAYS be the case, no matter the party in power, and no matter the spoils. If we trust the people to vote for who runs the country, why not let them vote for public construction projects?
CVella came out a cropper from this face-off. His arguments are circuitous and simplistic. The Times’ publishing James Tyrrell’s comments is proof that democracy exists? Balls. It only proves that they did not threaten or injure any vested interest or cherished political prejudice.
When I defended you, Daphne, in the very same paper, alleging that the editor was way off in claiming that what a magistrate did in her private life was entirely her business, my letter was REFUSED PUBLICATION. How’s that for democracy and pluralism??
Let’s face it. CVella’s and Tyrrell’s spat does not score highly on the linguistic and substantive scales. Had Tyrrell made his point more forcefully, more violently, more eloquently, and more persuasively, using deft language and elegant arguments the common folk are unaccustomed to, chances are that he would not have been published.
Malta boasts only a very stunted and caricatured version of democracy. Whether the situation would improve under the PL – of course – is another matter entirely.
He does not have a point. He is equating government refusal to call a referendum with dictatorship.
I wouldn’t take lessons in democracy from someone who doesn’t know the difference between direct democracry and representative democracy.
@ Etienne
I would not agree. Newspapers have an editorial policy. And newspapers need NOT be democratic.
It is the MODE OF GOVERNMENT of the state which has to be democratic.
So whereas you were right to defend Daphne, you are not right in expecting any newspaper to give you the right to voice your defence.
I think this is why Daphne has started her own blog – to have her own editorial policy, which she can freely exercise in a democratic environment.
Incidentally, what Daphne has actually contributed to the public debate is the public criticism of a magistrate. Here she is risking a lot, because of the friends of friends webs etc. Also, because some bright nincompoop might claim that she is attacking the impartiality of the judiciary – which of course she is NOT.
There is a very fine line between criticism and attacks. I think she has not overstepped it.
It is a sure sign of democracy that the executive branch has taken no steps ex officio against Daphne for her criticism of the judiciary.
It was the person – not the institution – who took steps. And this person will come to grief for having done so. But that is another point.
My point is that there is an imperfect democracy in Malta. We need to better it, to make government more tolerant of its adversaries and of those who disagree with it. That requires changing human nature. But we all need a goal in life, and better ourselves is one of the more noble goals one could ever aspire to have.
Whether a newspaper publishes a particular opinion does not determine whether a country is democratic. Whether a country is democratic determines whether independent newspapers can operate freely and decide their own editorial policy.
James A. Tyrrell clearly does not know what he’s talking about. If this were a dictatorship, he would not have a chance to speak given that the only views he ever expresses are oppositional.
Our version of democracy is countering a stupid argument with an equally stupid argument. Case in point being Emanuel Borg’s reply above.
This C Vella sounds like a close relative of yours ….
“First of all I’m not Irish I’m British.” That’s a lame excuse to get out of the “Englishman, Scotsman and Irishman” jokes.
This Irishman is politically British, but still an Irishman. What is he on about about not being Irish? And I bet he’s proud of it too.
His interlocuter (C Vella) was clearly ignorant of Irish politics and history though. See his comment about ‘Black and Tan’ – he clearly hasn’t a clue as to what a ‘black and tan’ was, or why they were called that. And it has nothing to do with the difference between the North and the Republic.
As to the main subject of their exchange – neither side comes out smelling of roses. C Vella is clearly not the most eloquent or rational of writers, and as for Tyrell – people in glass houses etc etc. His own nation, Northern Ireland, has been having a fair bit of trouble recently over the transfer of justice and policing powers.
Similarly, the unionist parties (which Tyrell is presumably a sympathiser of) have been reticent (to put it mildly) to apply ‘democratic principles’ (i.e. a referendum) when it comes to having a bill of rights for Northern Ireland.
Democracy, Mr Tyrell, is not something granted on a case-by-case basis.
The official name is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, so, politically, northern Ireland is not considered part of Great Britain and, technically speaking, Tyrrell cannot call himself British, even if he has what is commonly called a British (but should be UK) passport.
Maybe he ‘denounced’ his UK passport.
Shocking! The elves are now unleashing leprechauns on sites and blogs to generate more propoganda for the Leader!
James A. Tyrrell is not employed by the elves. He has joined them voluntarily to exorcise his own demons.
While he exorcises his demons we exercise our patience.
I deny any associations with this man you call James Tyrrell.
Why? Are you a leprechaun?
Just for the record….”Southern Ireland” stretches farther north than Northern Ireland by a few kms. Have a look at your atlas!
This is not James Tyrrell
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10495111
James A. Tyrrell – one thing got my goat on your response to Austin Gatt’s article – you either accuse or you do not accuse.
The “almost” is a subtle way of trying to throw a bad light on the goverment and, as such, highlights your inability to counter Austin Gatt’s arguments.
Your interpretation of democracy is limited and verges on the farcical – as such, it does not merit any reponse whatsoever.
So you’re hiding one of the goats!
Mr. Tyrrell – if you do not like how we do things in our country, there is always a very easy option – jump on to a plane and go back to wherever it is you came from.
North Canterbury, New Zealand.
He won’t because he cannot bear the thought of running out of potatoes again. He knows very well how compassionate his beloved Brits were the last time that happened.
Is it possible that Mr Tyrrell has been ‘naturalised’ to become a Maltese citizen. wef 7/9/09? Is he an Irish /English commoner or a Maltese mittelklass? http://www.doi.gov.mt/EN/gazetteonline/2009/10/gazts/GG%2023.10.pdf page 13023
Let him be. He’s the best Irish joke around.
He says he’s British, not Irish.
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