Today is Armistice Day
Even if you think only in ethnocentric terms, 600 military personnel who died in the First World War were Maltese.
At 11am, 90 years ago today, the guns fell silent at the end of the so-called “war to end all wars”.
Three of the last surviving British veterans of the First World War have just marked the anniversary at the Cenotaph in London. Henry Allingham, 112, Harry Patch, 110, and Bill Stone, 108, led a two-minute silence to remember the sacrifices made by the lost generation of 1914-1918. They represented the armed service they belonged to – for Mr Allingham the Royal Air Force, Mr Patch the Army and Mr Stone the Royal Navy.
Harry Patch, who was 16 when the war began and 20 when it ended, has described his experience to an interviewer. Imagine going through this at the age of 17, 18, 19 and 20. Mr Patch was 19 when he went through this experience in 1917.
“I can still see the bewilderment and fear on the men’s faces as we went over the top [of the trench at Pilckem Ridge]. We crawled because if you stood up you’d be killed. All over the battlefield the wounded of both sides were lying there all crying for help. But you couldn’t stop to help them. I came across a man who was ripped from shoulder to his waist with shrapnel, his stomach on the ground beside him. A bullet wound is clean – shrapnel tears you all to pieces. As I got to him he said, ‘Shoot me’. Before I could draw my revolver he died. I was with him for the last sixty seconds of his life.”
“The night I was wounded. The battalion had been relieved at ten o’clock and we were going back over open ground to the support line. The shell that got us was what we called a whizz-bang, which burst among us. The force of it threw me to the ground, but I didn’t realise I’d been hit for a few minutes. The burning hot metal knocks the pain out of you at first but I soon saw blood so I put a field-dressing on it. Then the pain started. I didn’t know what had happened to the others at first, but I was told later that I had lost three of my mates. We were a team together and those men were blown to pieces. I reacted very badly. It was like losing a part of my life. It upset me more than anything.”
“Even ninety years afterwards I still remember. I still commemorate 21st September and remember the three friends I lost. They are always with me. I don’t do anything. I don’t feel like talking. I’ve always remembered it. I don’t join in when people sing all the old songs and I don’t watch war films. Why should I? I was there. I can see that damned explosion now.”
“It was a sobering moment when I attended the 75th anniversary of the opening of the Menin Gate [in Belgium] and read all those name on the Gate. The sad thing was that so few of us knew each others’ surnames. We used first names and nicknames. I couldn’t find my old mates. But I see their faces in my dreams.”
“A few years ago I went back to Ypres, where I met one of the last surviving German veterans of the war, Charles Kuentz. He was 107. It was very emotional. We had both been on the same battlefield at Pilckem Ridge. For a while I hadn’t wanted to meet him, but I got a letter from him in Germany and he seemed like a nice man and I decided to meet him. He was a nice man and we talked, then we both sat in silence, staring out at the landscape. Both of us remembering the stench, the noise, the gas, the mud crusted with blood, the cries of the fallen comrades. We had both fought because we were told to. Sadly he did a year after I met him. Neither Charles not I ever want any other young man ever to go through what we did again, but still we send our lads to war.”
“I don’t think it is possible to truly explain the bond that is forged between a soldier in the trenches and his fellow soldiers. There you all are, no matter what your life in civvy street, covered in lice, desperately hungry, eking out the small treats – the ounce of tobacco, the biscuit. You relied on him and he on you, never really thinking that it was just the same for the enemy. But it was. It was every bit as bad.”
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I’ve just watched it. and Verdun and Ypres. My God, my God….what they must have endured. Of course they don’t want to hear the old songs, there was nothing to sing about.
Mario Debono:
Here’s what some of them endured.
“One day I was in a trench just eighteen yards from the nearest German trench, when the Germans sent a stick grenade flying over. They’d tied a couple of cigarettes to the grenade. After a bit,I went over to it. My mates said, ‘For God’s sake, don’t touch it.’ They thought it would go off and blow me up. But I went ahead and smoked one of the cigarettes and it was all right – so we sent the same stick bomb back with a whole packet attached. I hope they enjoyed them.
Another time, a shell landed close by me and I was buried up to my waist in thich mud, unable to move, and I was sinking. It was hopeless but I kept singing and I manage to attract a search party by singing ‘Nearer My God to Thee’. They pulled me out, bt my two comrades were never seen again. That shell hole became their grave.”
ALBERT ‘SMILER’ MARSHALL, 1st Battalion, Essex Yeomanry, died May 2005, aged 108.
“On days like Armistice Day, I pray for them. At the Cenotaph in 2004 I was thinking of the blokes I knew who burned. I saw them come down – men I knew, whose planes I knew – crashing into the ground.”
Henry Allingham, Royal Naval Air Service, born 6 June 1896, present at the Cenotaph today, 11 November 2008.
“Two of my brothers were killed in the first war – Thomas and William. Thomas was thirty-two when he died. WIlliam was only twenty-two when he was killed. He joined up on the day war broke out when he’d only just turned eighteen. He was with the 1st Battalion, Scots Guards. There were four of use who joined up. Only two came home.
Tom had his arm and leg shattered and he died in France in 1915, and he was buried where he died. One of his comrades buried him on the spot.
Bill joined up the day war broke out. He went to France with the Scots Guards, got frostbitten feet, and they had to cut his boots off. He came home to hospital and he lost two toes but he still had a trigger finger so they sent him back to France. He served right from the beginning of the war up to the last August. He served all those years and then he got killed. It broke my heart when he died – he was the closest to me in age. I think he must have died outright, as we never heard much about wounds or anything like that. Not many years ago they dug him up again and buried him together with Tom. Mum had gone by the time they did that, so she never knew.
I often think about my brother William – Bill. He used to hold my hand when we went to school. It broke my heart when he died. I would have liked to have died with him – but I didn’t, and here I am today.”
FRED LLOYD, Royal Field Artillery, died April 2005 aged 107
“Arras was the first time I went over the top. I got wounded at the end of that battle. I was temporarily blinded in one eye but it could have been worse. At the end of the battle, I lay bleeding in a trench. THere was blood coming out of my eye, pouring out all over my face. My head looked blown in. They thought I was dead and they were going to bury me. I was in a half-conscious state and I can remember a soldier getting hold of me and saying ‘this bloke’s alive’. I’d have been buried alive in Arras, if it hadn’t been for him.’
One night we were at the front and this man and I were talking. He got out a photo of a little girl. He said she was his little sister who prayed for him every night. Just moments later a shell burst near us, and a splinter of shrapnel went straight into his brain. He’d told me earlier that if anything happened to him, I must write to his mother and say that he died instantly. But I didn’t know his name. Everyone used to say the same thing. They asked anyone who survived to tell their mum that they’d died instantly. They wouldn’t have wanted them to know some of the things I saw and heard. You wouldn’t believe the terrible moaning and crying of the poor boys who were wounded, calling out ‘mum, mum’. It breaks my heart to think of it. Their suffering was terrible.
I remember once on the Somme, seeing half a dozen boys, all in pieces in a big shell hole. They were half buried. It was hot and the stench was terrible. Those poor boys. It made me sick. They were lying there, dying in pain and misery, and the rats were nibbling away at them.
People talk alot of rubbish about the war. I’ve always let people know what really went on. I’ve let people know so that the truth could be a warning to them. When the war was going on, its horrors were kept quiet and the full display of dreadful things only came out afterwards. These days, if any trigger-happy politicfan wants to start another war, it’s my job to let people know what that means. What do they know? Only those who were there can tell what really happened. Tell of the suffering and misery.”
CECIL WITHERS, 17th Battalion Royal Fusiliers, died April 2005, aged 107
Are we going to repeat this every year? Wars are happening every day in lots of countries, if we would commemorate every war, we would never stop. Actually a French parliamentary commission suggested to reduce the commemorative days in France from actually 14 to 3…
“My brother George was at Passchendale. Nigh on half a million Allied troops died there, all for five miles of mud! I was at King’s station when his regiment came home after the armistice. Most of them were carried off the train. I saw men with limbs missing, blind men – men who couldn’t breathe properly ‘cos their lungs had been shot to bits by mustard gas! While the nation celebrated they were hidden away in big grey buildings, far from the public gaze. I mean, courage like that could put you right off your victory dinner couldn’t it? They promised us homes fit for heroes; they give us heroes fit for homes!”
The above is part of a script from a British television programme, the actor was Lennard Pearce.
Henrik Piski: Remembrance Sunday’s commemoration is not of war but of those who died – in all wars.
Armistice Day’s commemoration is not of war, but of the importance of peace.
When “wars are happening every day in lots of countries”, those principles are all the more significant.
[Daphne – I’ve just watched the BBC World live transmission from Arlington National Cemetery in Washington, where it’s just after 11am. If you switch to that channel, it will be shown at regular intervals for the rest of the day. There have been transmissions from France, with President Sarkozy and the Prince of Wales, from Sydney, from London….]
Why should we commemorate such a bloodbath? It was such a pointless war. Thousands died to gain a few miles of territory only to be pushed backed the following month. You have to admit that the soldiers on both sides had no choice but to advance. It has either that or court marshaling for desertion or disobedience. I’m content that European powers have now at least agreed to collaborate together rather than engage in pointless fratricide.
[Daphne – We don’t commemorate the bloodbath. We commemorate those who died in it. Are you saying that after all that, they should be left unremembered?]
“I’m glad to be here. It means a lot to me. I hope people realise what my pals sacrificed on their behalf. May they never be forgotten. I can’t describe what they mean to me.”
HENRY ALLINGHAM, 112, at the Cenotaph in London, 11th November 2008
“I shall never forget it. I was one of the lucky ones and I’m thankful for that. Of course they should be remembered. If it wasn’t for them, we wouldn’t be here.”
BILL STONE, 108, at the Cenotaph in London, 11th November 2008
“It was not worth it, it was not worth one, let alone all the millions (who died).”
HARRY PATCH, 110, the last British survivor of the trench war, at a veteran’s meeting last month. That has been his lifelong position, which is why he was at the Cenotaph on 11th November 2008.
@Darren
Good one. That’s from Grandad in ‘Only Fools and Horses’.
What did they achieve? Nothing. They died a useless death. They should be remembered for dying a useless death, so that humankind can learn from its past mistakes. For that, and nothing else.
[Daphne – That may be the case with the First World War. It certainly wasn’t the case with the Second World War, unless you’re the sort who would have been pretty keen to live under under a bunch of psychotic Germans and get gassed because you don’t look like a Valkyrie.]
In the end, if you look at it from another angle, world war 2 seemed to be ineffective against Germany. Within 20 years the German economy was on its feet like never before and now it is the leading economy in the EU. All this in the space of 60 years. What the Germans didn’t win with weapons they won with economy.
The same thing with Japan. A leader in technology and another economic power.
[Daphne – You know, the longer I keep up this blog, the greater the temptation becomes to beat my head against a wall and weep copiously. Nobody was fighting against Germany’s economic strength, for God’s sake.]
John Meilak: Your comments underscore the point you deny – that commemoration is not only valuable but essential. Each generation needs to learn the lesson anew. Many in current and earlier generations do too.
John Meilak – Those people fought and many of them died so that the likes of you could live.
John Meilak: “Good one. That’s from Grandad in ‘Only Fools and Horses.”
Are you the fool or the horse?
There are many lessons to be learned from WWI, but you won’t be learning them from reruns of mediocre comedy shows.
There are no victors in wars but only losers on BOTH sides of the fence. The millions of innocent victims that were killed during wars throughout the centuries leaving behind wounds that never healed. The grief of mothers, wives and children who lost their loved ones for any cause, no matter how good the cause was or is, is a terrible thing to live with for the rest of your life. Unfortunately, the human race being what it is, there will never ever be a real and lasting Armistice Day to commemorate.
John Meilak: “What the Germans didn’t win with weapons they won with economy.”
You’re saying that a war ravaged country could achieve much and soon with little. That makes war deaths – and their commemoration – all the more poignant.
At you all. These wars were pointless if you don’t look at what’s what behind them. What caused them. Certainly the Second World War was anything but pointless. They died, so that we could have the life we have now. Does anyone dispute that? They all wanted a better tomorrow for themselves and their children, who are us. They died for that simple human belief and longing. They fought not against the Germans, but against tyranny and darkness. You know, even the most ramollit Mintoffian ex-dockyard man who saw the whole war through believes that. Why should we do otherwise ?
Herbie: “There will never ever be a real and lasting Armistice Day to commemorate.”
Maybe not, but the world can try. And Armistice Day can play a role there, reminding everyone of the importance of peace not just the futility of (some) wars.
I think the one of the most moving inscriptions is that commemorating those who fell at Gallipoli mostly Anzacs it was written by Kemal Ataturk. It is even more significant because Ataturk was remembering former enemies. Here it is.
Those heroes that shed their blood and lost their lives… You are now lying in the soil of a friendly country. Therefore rest in peace. There is no difference between the Johnnies and the Mehmets to us where they lie side by side now here in this country of ours… you, the mothers, who sent their sons from faraway countries wipe away your tears; your sons are now lying in our bosom and are in peace. After having lost their lives on this land. They have become our sons as well.
@Amanda Mallia
First of all, I wasn’t born during the war. And secondly, they did not ‘fight’ for ‘me’. They rather fought to defend their own interests: to keep the shipping lanes free from Nazi raids. As if, kinu ha jibku biki tad-demm ghax imutu naqa maltin.
Seeing this ungrateful attitude towards the Maltese, my ancestors used their mind and took shelter in the countryside rather than risking their neck for the English in the harbour. To whom they didn’t owe anything. Thus, my predecessors ‘saved’ me, if you want to put it like that.
We did not end up buried under the rubble so that the ungrateful English could live another day. So what if Germany occupied Malta? Another conqueror added to the list. As if we weren’t used to that. I tell you, we could have outlived them as we have always outlived any conqueror. What did the English give us in return for helping them defend Malta? A stupid george cross.
[Daphne – Thank God I’ve just spent the last half-hour watching South Park.]
John Meilak – Are you a relation of Toni Abela by any chance? You seem to have the same sort of mentality.
John Meilak:
“So what if Germany occupied Malta? Another conqueror added to the list.”
I suppose the past anti-semitism would have been a happy repeat for you. I can’t believe that after what we know of Germany during WWII you can say such a thing. I’m personally ashamed of my own country’s (still Swedish) cowardly pacifism during the war and here you boast over your own relatives doing the very same. I do not claim that everyone have to be a hero, but at the very least have some respect for the people who actually stood their ground.
John Meilak,
The British never conquered Malta remember? They were invited in.
You speak like Malta was always “its own”! Malta was for the greater part of its history the territory of kingdoms, in the same way Gozo is a part of the republic of Malta. Come to think of it there was a twit who spoke about independence for Gozo.
[Daphne – Part of the problem is the way history is taught here: valiant Maltese variously being occupied and throwing out the occupier. Nobody seems to realise that there was no concept of Maltese nationhood. That emerged as late as the 20th century, which is why we are still exploring it in 2008. A cursory look at the telephone directory is enough to tell us what being Maltese meant: a large number of surnames just indicate place of origin or ethnic origin.]
John Meilak, whoever you are, you have got it so spectacularly wrong.
To start with, if we got a lousy deal (and that is debatable) from the British, after independence, it is nothing but our own fault, or the fault of our jingoistic politicians who cooked up the fallacy that somehow we are a nation unto ourselves.
Secondly, if the George Cross is “stupid”, then so are flags, national anthems, awards, trophies, ceremonies, cemeteries, funerals, the Sette Giugno memorial, the Great Siege monument, the whole lot. I see you belong to the “mietna ta’ xejn” brigade. Tell me, do you think there’s anything worth dying for at all? And do you think any soldier, or his/her family will smile with delight and applaud John Meilak on being told that his/her comrades have died in vain?
@ John Meilak:
“So what if Germany (read Nazis) occupied Malta? Another conqueror added to the list”.
Are you serious? What’s next…denial of the Holocaust?
[Daphne – I think we should ask what kind of home John Meilaq grew up in. It’s my experience that the attitude of Maltese people born after World War II, towards that war, almost always reflects that of their parents and of the home in which they grew up.]
Speaking of the George Cross, I wonder if the time has come when it should be removed from the Maltese Flag. Yes, it is an honour and all that, but as an independent country, should we be proud of another country’s honours? Am I alone in thinking that the placing of another country’s award, again whilst acknowledging its significance, and the spirit in which it was bestowed, on our National Flag, give the impression that we are still subservient, however unintentionally, to other countries?
[Daphne – Why don’t we do away with the colours altogether then? According to legend, somebody called Roger the Norman bestowed them on us – which is rubbish, of course. Do you know about the principle of maximising your advantages, whatever and whichever they may be? Why ditch something that sets you apart, wherever it came from?]
John Meilak: You seem to assume – incorrectly – that the Second World War was a quibble between two countries and that Malta-the-independent-nation-if-only-LInglizi-weren’t-here was accidentally caught up in between. Perhaps that’s because you haven’t really thought about the meaning of the words “second” and “world” in the term “Second World War”, or of the historical implications of the war itself.
Your reductive view of WWII as “keeping shipping lanes free from Nazi raids” doesn’t describe the motivation for war though it describes something that happened during its course. Had it not been for that particular effort all your predecessors – that includes your ancestors too – would have starved to death.
The significance of the George Cross is clearly lost on you. The George Cross is awarded for “acts of the greatest heroism or of the most conspicuous courage in circumstances of extreme danger”. It was awarded to the people of Malta – and that includes your relatives in the countryside – “to bear witness to a heroism and a devotion that will long be famous in history”.
You may not know, not having looked closely enough, that the circular medallion of the George Cross is surrounded by the words “for gallantry”. Perhaps we should not be surprised that you believe the award is insignificant, given your ungallant attitude towards those who received and deserved the award, and who are still alive and able to read your dismissive remarks.
Not everyone wants to be a hero, John Meilak, but you should at least have some respect for those who really are. Most of all, it would cost you nothing at all to show respect for the dead and those they left behind. Just don’t belittle their sacrifice with inane and uninformed remarks.
Vanni: “as an independent country, should we be proud of another country’s honours?”
Why ever not? Pride and subservience are not the same thing and flags are not like underpants, to be changed every day or according to the prevailing mood. In a country so desperate to win that festival of camp known as the Eurovision song contest, I’m surprised you ask the question at all.
@ Daphne
Do you consider the George Cross itself as the advantage? Or do you consider the implied acceptance of the bestower as the advantage? In other words, if instead of the George Cross, we would have its equivalent on our flag bestowed by one of our ex brothers from the Mintoffian times, would you still hold dear to your argument? Quite apart from the fact that I feel that we should not harbour any need to feel that we require anything to make us stand out. I am quite proud of the fact that I am Maltese, and don’t need (or care really) for any other country’s (whichever that country may be) approbation.
[Daphne – People going about puffing their chests and claiming to be proud to be Maltese remind me of bullfrogs in the mating season. You have no idea how off-putting it is to others, the equivalent of an English football hooligan brandishing the Union Flag and saying he’s proud to be British while stamping on a wop’s head. The George Cross is a prestigious award. An award given by Ceacescu or Pol Pot is not a prestigious award, but an embarrassment. We do require everything we can that makes us stand out, because otherwise we’re just a bloody rock suspended halfway between Sicily and Tunis that has somehow, by a mixture of ability and miracle, become an EU member state. Be realistic. Do a bit of travelling round the hundreds of geographically near-identical islands in the Mediterranean and experience wonder at the sequence of fortunate strokes that made us what we are rather than Lampedusa or yet another Greek-type island where everyone packs up and goes to Athens for the winter.]
The way some of these people write (e.g. the John Meilaks type) makes me feel like crying and at the same time throwing in the towel. Why should I keep on working hard to improve the conditions of my country when I know that in a few years’ time people will comment that I did this only for my sake and not for the sake of future generations? And to think that these are the ones who can, with their vote, decide my future! As for the George Cross, this was an award to the Maltese nation and it has nothing to do with conquerors or colonisers. So please just stop writing nonsense.
Oh Christ, here we go again. I know if I’d won a George Cross, or a Victoria Cross, I’d have it tattooed on my chest, damn it.
Here’s an anecdote for you, which says it all. The only foreigner I ever came across to mention the George Cross on our flag was a soldier, and a Frenchman to boot (they being the Nation We Love To Hate). When I told him I was Maltese and all, he said, “Ah, Malta! The only country in the world with a medal for bravery on its flag.” I had to check it out, but it’s true.
Soldiers wear decorations awarded by other countries on their uniform. Why, our own Dear Leader Mintoff proudly accepted a Libyan award. Why can’t a whole country do likewise?
H. P. Baxxter: Aside from all that, the cross is there and there’d have to be a reason to remove it. The only argument ever made “justifying” the removal of the George Cross from our flag is that its presence is a badge of dishonour to Malta’s nationhood.
You’d have thought that as Malta grew up, it would have shed its inferiority complex. The remove-the-cross brigade fail to see the irony of their position. It is the removal of the cross, and not its presence, that signals a sense of inferiority and subservience. Anyone who feels confident of their nationhood cannot be shamed by honour.
[Daphne – Another interesting point is this: how else would we have got a medal for bravery if not from somebody else? Maybe these people are suggesting we should give ourselves one and look like prats?]
@ Corinne
The mass nationalistic hysteria that surrounds the Eurovision is one of the low points of the maltese psyche (IMHO anyway). I cringe every time I read the online comments, claiming unfairness, bribery, neighbour voting etc etc. Please don’t remind me of that :-) . Joking apart, I am not saying that we should change our flag on the slightest whim. I am only asking why we feel the need to show what others think of us.
@ Daphne
When I said I am proud to be Maltese, I meant that I do not need anybody to make me feel proud. I do not give a toss about what others think of me, and the cross is only an acknowledgement of the respect others held Malta in(valuable and appreciated however that is, or rather in view of some previous comments, should be). However, whilst acknowledging that you do have a point, as by bandying the cross around (seeing that most of our tourism hails from the UK, it does provide an affinity with the Brits), I do wonder if we are not sacrificing our independence (for what it’s worth in this day and age).
@ H.P. Baxter
Just because Mintoff accepted an award does not strenghten your argument my friend. And yes I agree with you, that you should be proud to show off your medal, but this is not a person, but a country we are talking about.
[Daphne – I can’t quite understand how having the George Cross on the Maltese flag affects Malta’s independence, given that Malta is an EU member state, and even if it were not.]
Vanni: “I am only asking why we feel the need to show what others think of us.”
See my earlier comment above for an answer.
Vanni, you are wrong. The George Cross was awarded to the people of Malta (now you’ll throw the “to the Island and people of Malta” quote at me…). It being humanly impossible to issue a medal to every person on the island, the George Cross was pinned, as it were, to the flag. Individuals and units, civilians or otherwise, ALWAYS display all their decorations, awarded by any country.
Look, a flag is a flag is a flag. It is the product of a people’s history. It is not there to “show what others think of us”, or we’d have pinned, er, the latest Ernst & Young report to it.
[Daphne – Make that Ernest and Young.]
“Daphne – I think we should ask what kind of home John Meilaq grew up in. It’s my experience that the attitude of Maltese people born after World War II, towards that war, almost always reflects that of their parents and of the home in which they grew up”
My parents taught me that I do not owe anything to anyone or any government or foreign power that rules us. As long as the authority doesn’t bother me, I don’t bother it. That has been our way, through the generations. Of course, there were instances in Malta’s history where the authority bothered the local population and got the expected result (Monroy? French occupation?). But of course, neither I would offer a willing hand to a foreign power which looked down upon us.
@Corinne
Of course the Maltese have been brave during the war. We Maltese are natural born survivors, and the Gozitans even more so (Meilak is a gozitan surname). However, we have been brave for an unworthy master. Read “Maltin Fil-Gwerra” and you’ll know what I mean. What was the use of the George cross at the time, when the people were homeless and hungry? The Maltese deserved much more than a simple cloth.
“Not everyone wants to be a hero, John Meilak, but you should at least have some respect for those who really are. Most of all, it would cost you nothing at all to show respect for the dead and those they left behind.”
I prefer to be a survivor than a hero. However, getting hit by a bomb doesn’t make you a hero. It makes you a casualty. It is not bloody likely that you’re going to stop it by standing in its path. If the fallen Maltese used their head and took shelter away from the harbour rather than swallowing English propaganda they’d be here today to tell us their stories. If the English REALLY wanted to defend Malta they would have brought more troops and supplies, and not use the Maltese people as convenient cannon fodder.
@H.P. Baxxter
To die for another’s interests IS in vain. Malta still got the same treatment as it had always had even after the war. Heroes for nothing. George crosses and other symbols mean nothing if they are not made to mean something. Did they give my great-uncle (a gunner) a bonus for defending Malta? Or some medal? No. He fought only to get nothing. He only got a heap of rubble to live in and a hand minus three fingers. God save the Queen!
@Pat
What do I care for the wars of others? Let them decimate each other. I will never fight the wars of others. I do not owe anything to anybody.
@Amanda Mallia
I’m not a relative of Toni Abela. Sorry if I shattered your hopes.
[Daphne – “My parents taught me that I do not owe anything to anyone or any government or foreign power that rules us. As long as the authority doesn’t bother me, I don’t bother it.” You do realise that this is typical southern Mediterranean thinking, the sort which gave rise to organisations like the Mafia and allowed them to survive, do you?]
It’s always sad to remember about WW1 and the wars since then. Today fighting goes on in several countries. Heard on the BBC yday that rebels in Congo rounded up a whole classroom of children aged 10 -12 years and ‘offered’ them to be either porters, soldiers or sex slaves for their army.
“An award given by Ceacescu or Pol Pot is not a prestigious award, but an embarrassment.”
Can’t believe you forgot Gaddafi there.
John Meilak: Thank you for your suggestion but I do not need to read any publication to know of life during WWII. My parents, their siblings and their parents, uncles and aunts and some of their grandparents lived through WWII – just as, I understand, yours did – though their lives were not all made up of scurrying away to safety and looking out for themselves.
It does seem, however, that you are in dire need of doing some reading yourself. I imagine you’ve heard of the Santa Marija convoy, but you seem to know little of the men who served on those ships and the many who died trying to bring them to shore. I’ll hazard a guess – and that is only to give the benefit of the doubt as to why you bear such a grudge – that you know nothing of the other convoys that never made it to harbour. Nor do you seem to know anything at all of the hundreds of men, most of whom were NOT Maltese, who died attempting to bring in those supply ships and whose grave is not some marble adorned mausoleum but a shipwreck at the bottom of the sea. Now, please don’t embarrass yourself any further by claiming that none of those supplies were ever intended to feed the civilian population.
You need it spelled out to you, so here it is loud and clear: S-0-M-E M-A-L-T-E-S-E C-H-O-S-E T-O F-I-G-H-T and they didn’t do that by faffing around, throwing hissy fits and sulking. They didn’t fight “for the English”. They fought for a cause.
Your latest comment about the George Cross is so pitiful it cannot even be described as pathetic. Aside from your absurd comment that the cross is ‘made of cloth’, you’re mistaken in thinking the award was made in lieu of housing and food or that its value should be measured on a utilitarian scale.
Those members of my family who fought with the British Army, the Maltese regiments, and the US Army did so against the spread of fascism, which was incompatible with their political beliefs though not with the political beliefs of other Maltese at the time. They did not fight for “the English”, your perception being that there were only ‘the English’ on one side and only ‘the Germans’ on the other. This was a world war, remember, not a pitched battle between cowboys and Indians.
No matter your pleas to the contrary, it is because people fought the Axis powers and many lost their lives doing so that people like you are able to live in freedom and say whatever you like. Others who fought with the Allies were not so fortunate, because they were condemned to life behind the Iron Curtain. It is a poor service to the memory of those who died and a slight to those who survived that you use your freedom to discredit their sacrifice by rudely dismissing it as useless.
@ John Meilak – the way you think (or as you said was taught by your parents [sic]) shows you as an ungrateful, spiteful and selfish being.
Being part of society one has rights but also duties, so yes we need to bother not only about those that govern us but also about our civic duties. And yes, we need to care about the wars of others, if not out of altruism, out of self preservation – World War II was mainly the fault of European and World rulers not bothering about Hitler’s mini wars and encroachments.
With persons like you I have no problem in explaining the way Maltese society has evolved.
Meilak, if you live as you do, not being arsed about anything as long as it doesn’t bother you, then everything you do is “for another’s interest”. So nothing is worth dying for.
Then, one fine day, your grandchildren will ask you what you did during the war. And you will answer: “I minded my own business.” Your great-uncle did his duty. He couldn’t ask for more. Soldiering is not a job, it is a vocation. You don’t get bonuses for getting shot at or being wounded in battle. But you can get laid for the rest of you life on the stories you take back.
(And then Monroy, and the “French occupation”….Jeez, do you get your history from Guzé Galea?)
John Meilak: “My parents taught me that I do not owe anything to anyone”
And did they also teach you that nobody owes anything to you? If they didn’t, take hope. You’re still in time to learn that lesson on your own.
Corinne, well done and nicely said. And as the saying goes “They gave their today for our tomorrow’’. One little fact I would like to point out, if you will allow me: never was a convoy bound for Malta completely annihilated. Ships pertaining to the convoys were sunk, sometimes over 50% of them, but somehow a few of these ships always made it to the harbour. And as long as even one ship made it, it was a small victory. The only convoy that never made it to Malta was because it turned back to Gibraltar.
@HP Baxxter
Something which renders me benefit (monetary or otherwise) is something worthy of doing. Something which leads you to getting killed so that a fat ass of a general can boast about his ‘glorious victory’ is pure idiocy.
“Then, one fine day, your grandchildren will ask you what you did during the war”
How will I tell them that, if I get killed in the first place? Your logic makes no sense whatsoever. My great-uncle did that only because he had no other choice, not because he really wanted too. He never did talk about it actually. Nothing to boast about, really. Can he get his fingers back? What stories can he tell? Tell us about his friends’ blood splattering on his uniform, and their internal organs flying about like mincemeat? Is that what you want children to hear?
“Soldiering is not a job, it is a vocation”
Appuntu. Int stess qed tghida. If it truly a vocation then ACCORDING TO YOU my predecessors and I, have a RIGHT not to serve in any pointless war.
@Chris II
“And yes, we need to care about the wars of others, if not out of altruism, out of self preservation – World War II was mainly the fault of European and World rulers not bothering about Hitler’s mini wars and encroachments.”
You undermine your own argument. If it was the fault of European and World rulers than why should Malta care? Malta is neither of them.
Since when going to war is a civic duty? I thought conscription was abolished a long time ago. I don’t know where you’re living actually. In cloud cuckoo-land perhaps. Or maybe you saw too much of those war films always portraying the war as a glorious undertaking when in fact it was one of the most horrific bloodbaths in history.
I’ve no need of you to explain to me the way Maltese society evolved. It evolved out of pure survival instincts.
@ Corinne
“Those members of my family who fought with the British Army, the Maltese regiments, and the US Army did so against the spread of fascism, which was incompatible with their political beliefs though not with the political beliefs of other Maltese at the time.”
Basically they were “midhla” with the English. No need to explain further dear. I’m very certain most of them survived the war. And I’m very certain they didn’t feel the hunger pangs their fellow countrymen did. No wonder you’re defending the English with such passion.
“You need it spelled out to you, so here it is loud and clear: S-0-M-E M-A-L-T-E-S-E C-H-O-S-E T-O F-I-G-H-T and they didn’t do that by faffing around, throwing hissy fits and sulking. They didn’t fight “for the English”. They fought for a cause.”
Iddahhaqx. No Maltese ‘chose’ to fight. I know the Maltese mentality, if they can get by without doing something, they will get by without doing it.
Fought for a cause. Tajba din. So losing limbs and fingers is a cause skond int?
“No matter your pleas to the contrary, it is because people fought the Axis powers and many lost their lives doing so that people like you are able to live in freedom and say whatever you like”.
What freedom?
[Daphne – Madonna, what a loser. No wonder half the working population in this country supports the other half who are on the state payroll or on benefits, with this kind of mentality. Well, John Meilak, you’re not going to set the world alight, that’s for sure.]
Corinne, what do I need from others? I have everything I need.
I don’t need people to owe me things (unless I lend them money of course).
I probably shouldn’t bother, but what the hell. Nothing better to do right now.
“Something which renders me benefit (monetary or otherwise) is something worthy of doing. Something which leads you to getting killed so that a fat ass of a general can boast about his ‘glorious victory’ is pure idiocy.”
You start by setting the tone for your own absence of morals. What you described yourself is a textbook example of a sociopath, someone who feel no moral obligation to others unless there is a benefit to himself.
“How will I tell them that, if I get killed in the first place? Your logic makes no sense whatsoever. My great-uncle did that only because he had no other choice, not because he really wanted too. He never did talk about it actually. Nothing to boast about, really. Can he get his fingers back? What stories can he tell? Tell us about his friends’ blood splattering on his uniform, and their internal organs flying about like mincemeat? Is that what you want children to hear?”
War is a mess. War is bloody. War is unfortunate in every way. That does not mean we should put the blinkers on and pretend it’s not a part of the world we live in. You may choose not to fight and even inspire others to follow lead, until one day you find yourself under the rule of a tyrant. Pacifism may at moments sound like a moral stance, but it is not sustainable.
“You undermine your own argument. If it was the fault of European and World rulers than why should Malta care? Malta is neither of them.”
Malta is not a part of Europe? Malta is not a part of the world? Where the hell am I, the moon?
“Since when going to war is a civic duty? I thought conscription was abolished a long time ago. I don’t know where you’re living actually. In cloud cuckoo-land perhaps. Or maybe you saw too much of those war films always portraying the war as a glorious undertaking when in fact it was one of the most horrific bloodbaths in history.”
Conscription is a reality in many countries still (my own country of birth included) and emergency conscriptions are in general carried out when a nation is under threat. Not a single person in this thread has hinted at war being glorious or a positive thing, so take your non sequitur and shove it somewhere.
“I’ve no need of you to explain to me the way Maltese society evolved. It evolved out of pure survival instincts.”
Oh, so a modernisation in accordance to the rest of Europe didn’t affect it? Or due to the monetary advantages it actually received due to being a British colony (don’t take me wrong, I’m against colonisation, but there is no denying that Malta has achieved a lot due to the British, especially in the form of a steady and flourishing tourism)? Or the joining of the European Union? It was all due to survival instincts you say. Doesn’t sound like a very thought-out idea.
“Basically they were “midhla” with the English. No need to explain further dear. I’m very certain most of them survived the war. And I’m very certain they didn’t feel the hunger pangs their fellow countrymen did. No wonder you’re defending the English with such passion.”
If there was a food shortage and the choice was between distributing the food to the ones who actually helped out in the war like Corinne’s relatives and the cowards of your family, by what virtue would you propose the second being the right choice?
“Iddahhaqx. No Maltese ‘chose’ to fight. I know the Maltese mentality, if they can get by without doing something, they will get by without doing it.”
Being an outsider I have seen my fair share of the type of Maltese you are describing, but there is a also a large portion who strive for something better. Who dedicate their life to achieving something, rather than sitting home blaming everyone else for their everyday problems. You have already admitted yourself to belonging to the group of Maltese who wouldn’t lift a finger unless it was for personal gain, so perhaps it’s time you take a look at your own life and try to become something better. Striving for something greater in life is quite addictive, you should try it sometime.
“Fought for a cause. Tajba din. So losing limbs and fingers is a cause skond int?”
Yes.
“What freedom?”
The freedom not to be put in a camp due to your skin colour. The freedom to actually voice your opinion in discordance with the state. The freedom to vote. The freedom to believe in what you want. The freedom to know you will receive medical care in case of injury or disease. The freedom to travel freely inside the whole of Europe. The freedom to criticise those who you are in disagreement with and praise the ones you agree with. The freedom to own your own property and belongings. The freedom to sit at home at a computer and write stupid things in someone’s blog. The restriction of any of those freedoms is a sad reality in many parts of the world and the stand that was taken against oppression in the two world wars has been a potent force in building such a society.
You, sir, are an ungrateful prick.
John Meilak: “What do I need from others? I have everything I need.”
Honey, that just about sums you up. Truly none are so blind as those who will not see. What are the odds that you didn’t pay your way through higher education? Clearly you do feel that something is owed to you because you’d never have accepted that situation, would you?
One time while on holiday in Germany I visited Flosenberg concentration camp.
This was not the normal type of camp but was solely reserved for those who spoke
against the Third Reich and allied prisoners or war.
It is the place where General Canaries (he was one of the major outspoken persons against Hitler) and others were executed only hours before the Allies liberated the camp. The sense one gets on entering is of absolute evil, the silence is deafening. You do not even hear birds chirping.
You walk and read the names on the small crosses that overflow the vast gardens. In some instances a small inscription notes that ‘Here lies ….. buried by his friend …..’ and a couple of crosses later you note the name of the ‘friend’ on another small cross.
On reaching the end of the garden one finds himself in a terrace overlooking a yard beautifully landscaped with a dozen pyramids some 4/5 meters high with a base of about 3/4 meters per side. It is nice to look at, but only when one goes down into the yard and reads the inscriptions on the pyramids does one shudder:
‘This pyramid is made up of the burned remains of prisoners of war in memory of the (number of prisoners of war) from (country) executed in this camp.’
Further on, following the rail tracks, one finds himself at the ovens, four in a row.
No one is allowed to leave anything there but a red rose and a lit candle at one of the ovens is replaced daily.
It is a known fact that a nearby river was clogged with ashes and changed course.
Up the hill one finds what was once the main guard house which has since been turned into a chapel. It is bare, cold stone wherever one rests his eyes. A huge cross hangs suspended in mid air at the back. The walls are bare except for two by one foot boxes all around the chapel. The inscription on the boxes reads:
‘Soil gathered from (country) in memory of the (number of prisoners of war) executed in this camp’
As I have stated in earlier write ups, I am interested in all religions for the logic behind them, and am not religious, but here one is forced by human nature to kneel and cry.
This is the shape of the world that would have been if the sacrifice of the few didn’t change the course of history for the many.
And some writers here cannot care less.
That is evil.
Me: “those who spoke against the Third Reich and allied prisoners or war.”
I think you meant “and for allied prisoners of war”.
I share your sentiment but we have to allow for the fact that some people were raised in an environment that deprived them of the opportunity to understand the world they live in.
@Corinne Vella
Thank you for the correction –
There can be no excuse, today more than ever the world is at anyones fingertips.
http://www.shoaheducation.com/camps/flossenberg.html
http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/Britain-Has-New-Oldest-Man-Henry-Allingham-First-World-War-Veteran-Surpasses-John-Evans/Article/200903415251363?lpos=UK_News_Second_Home_Page_Article_Teaser_Region_0&lid=ARTICLE_15251363_Britain_Has_New_Oldest_Man%3A_Henry_Allingham%2C_First_World_War_Veteran%2C_Surpasses_John_Evans